tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post7423747472127941878..comments2024-02-28T00:43:53.934-08:00Comments on "It's okay; Gary sent us.": Grimoires: "Real" magic and what it can teach us.Will Mistrettahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18403399118961902073noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-82385549476947585012010-09-03T22:12:27.603-07:002010-09-03T22:12:27.603-07:00I read an interesting article somewhere about John...I read an interesting article somewhere about John Dee's relationship with Edward Kelly, a reputed forger and all-around rogue, suggesting that Dee's written communications (in Enochian) with the Watchers was the result of a hoax perpetrated by Kelly.Mike Linkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01784154580326623886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-46805704383042011552010-08-23T15:15:18.207-07:002010-08-23T15:15:18.207-07:00If you're looking at Grimoires contra D&D ...If you're looking at Grimoires contra D&D spells, what about John Dee vs. your typical wizard? Wife-swapping, angel-talking, crystal-wielding, library destroyed while he was adventuring out of the country. Royal Astrologer. Never mind the rumors he was a spymaster.<br /><br />Here's one of his scrying mirrors, now in the British Museum: An Aztec mirror. Seriously<br /><br />http://miskatonicmuseum.blogspot.com/2009/10/john-dees-aztec-scrying-mirror.html<br /><br />And of course, posthumously gets to translate the Necronomicon into English.ahtzibhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03577845276318742985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-5771677881079810942010-08-21T04:59:31.247-07:002010-08-21T04:59:31.247-07:00Great topic. Those crazy old grimoires have a lot...Great topic. Those crazy old grimoires have a lot of potential for gaming.<br /><br />I really got a kick out of A.E. Waite's book (published under various titles like The book of Spells and The Book of Ceremonial Magic) which more or less reproduces the text of a bunch of grimoires, in translation (I think he says he changed some of the details of the rituals -- he believed in that stuff!) The infamous list of demons in Fantasy Wargaming, edited by Bruce Galloway, mostly derives the demons from grimoires too. GURPS Voodoo coam pretty close to modeling that sort of magic, and I tried adapting more grimoire-style stuff to it in my "GURPS Magick" pdfs at my site.<br /><br />The novel Moonchild (by Aleister Crowley!) depicts a bunch of magicians and their attempts to use magic against each other, which mkaes it kind of helpful for imagining how it would work.<br /><br />I don't recall where I read tihs but one theory about the grimoires that I always thought was near-perfect is this: They are manuals for training in lucid dreaming. Notice the rituals are usually to be performed in the wee early hours? The idea is that the preparations of candles, incense, and drawing circles are things to do before falling asleep. Then you do the rest of the ritual in a lucid dream, and use the imagery suggested by he grimoire to have interesting dreams (whether they be sex fantasies or flying or what have you!). That's not necessarily as useful for gaming though, unless perhaps you are doing HPL's Dreamlands?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-82692751219771559042010-08-12T21:42:00.076-07:002010-08-12T21:42:00.076-07:00Great topic for discussion and research. Thanks fo...Great topic for discussion and research. Thanks for the links!JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08532311924539491087noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-40733114313884814842010-08-12T20:59:12.547-07:002010-08-12T20:59:12.547-07:00Penn State University Press has a series called &q...Penn State University Press has a series called "Magic In History", which is pretty good.<br /><br />http://www.psupress.org/books/series/book_SeriesMagic.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-34956231101564603902010-08-12T10:08:31.200-07:002010-08-12T10:08:31.200-07:00""Odin, Thor, and Satan who dwell togeth...""Odin, Thor, and Satan who dwell together..."<br /><br />Now *that's* a sitcom!Will Mistrettahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18403399118961902073noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-41356776422538840822010-08-12T09:48:11.114-07:002010-08-12T09:48:11.114-07:00"The Black Books of Elverium" by Mary Ru..."The Black Books of Elverium" by Mary Rustad is a translation of two books found in Norway. "Galdrabok" by Stephen Flowers is a translation of an Icelandic one; there's another one that I have at home published by an Icelandic museum, but the title escapes me at the moment. <br /><br />They're an interesting sub-genre of grimoires with their own conventions and so forth (I am especially fond of the occasional bits of Norse mythology that creep in, such as the incantation that includes something to the effect of "Odin, Thor, and Satan who dwell together...").Greyhawk Grognardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13929743865700766901noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-54382578368419540562010-08-12T09:20:44.127-07:002010-08-12T09:20:44.127-07:00Could you perhaps point me at some good English tr...Could you perhaps point me at some good English translations of those?Will Mistrettahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18403399118961902073noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9113217136376400257.post-18107862875483030212010-08-12T05:00:02.593-07:002010-08-12T05:00:02.593-07:00You should definitely check out "Grimoires: A...You should definitely check out "Grimoires: A History of Magic Books" by Owen Davies. It's a scholarly treatment of the subject, and quite excellent.<br /><br />I'm a fan of the various Black Books (Scandinavian examples of the grimoire tradition) myself.Greyhawk Grognardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13929743865700766901noreply@blogger.com